WHERE'S THE SMOKING GUN!!!!

evreport 9 months ago

There is none. You know it and I know it. Every once in a while they announce a smoking gun is imminent. Once it appears, there is no smoke, but they keep shooting those blanks, anyhow.

blairsmomma 9 months ago

First of all it is birthers, not birfers!!! He is not consitutionally able to serve. First and foremost the constitution states only a natural born citizen is eligable to serve. He clearly does not meet the requirements!! Both parents have to be citizens of the USA, cleary his old man was not. He was Kenyan, which we all know. In 1962 Kenya fell under British rule. These two provisions alone disqualify him.

I think his grandma would remember where her grandson was born, and she states she was present at his birth in Kenya!!

You are not a normal American, because clearly you could give a dam about the constitution and what it stands for.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

blairsmomma,

Do you mind if I address your two primary concerns?

First, I agree with you that NBC ought to mean both parents are U.S. citizens. There exist several legal precedents that say this is so. The problem is, there are also several legal precedents that say U.S. citizenship is obtained by being born on U.S. soil. It is a paradox of the law that Obama is straddling. I put this question to several very good lawyers and they've assured me born in Hawaii means NBC, despite my own reservations. Still, I would like the SCOTUS to clarify the definition.

Given that legal precedent goes both ways, two-parent NBC does not qualify as a smoking gun. Even if the SCOTUS defines it as such now, it will not apply to Obama retroactively. At best it will only apply to his 2012 run.

The granny tape is another matter. Have you actually heard the full tape? It's a translation of a translation, and would never be accepted in any American court as evidence. But still, if you listen to the tape, the person who is questioning Obama's grandmother confused her about who was being discussed. Obama SR. WAS born in Kenya and she acknowledged this. When it was explained that the questioner was talking about Obama Jr., she emphatically noted that he was born in America.

Given that this tape qualifies as hearsay evidence and given that the full tape actually verifies that Obama Jr was born in Hawaii, the tape certainly does not qualify as a smoking gun.

shadowmongoose72 9 months ago

I have no heard or read anyone saying suppose his B.C. is fake.But I have heard people say his B.C. IS a forgery.Remember when it comes to assuming you tards are first in line.The ass in assume is all yours.
If you been paynig attention,the smoking gun is locked up as tight as a million bucks and corrupt allies in the occupied government can make it.
Anyone ever accuse you of paying attention?You all know it is no big thing to show a B.C. and this is what keeps it going.And btw it is what got it started too.
Nothing to do with lame McCain losing either.And if he won you can bet he would have to produce the papers requested also.Oh yes that's right he did.Interesting how you clowns accuse people of being sore losers.When they went to both parties with the same problem.SHOW THE DAM INFO TO THE PEOPLE'S SATISFACTION.ALL OF IT.

rulrich 9 months ago

Blackmonrikker, come on! You want a smoking gun??! Are you a raging lunatic? If the fact that he is hiding his school records, medical records, and long-form birth certificate behind $1 million in lawyer's fees doesn't strike you as some sort of smoking gun, then either you're just naive, plain ignorant, or your one of Obama's minions yourself.

And if you want to talk about laws, go read the most important law, the CONSTITUTION!

Obama has left a trail of feces on our country's most important document and everybody is looking the other way, including yourself. Your asking for a smoking gun? Shame on you.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

"I have heard people say his B.C. IS a forgery"

That accusation first came from an internet poster named Techdude over at Hillary's Village. Techdude claimed he took the BC digital image from the Factcheck site and found Obama's sister's name embedded in the image. He concluded that Obama had used his sister's BC and overtyped it with his own data.

When this was proven false another supposed digital expert named Ron Polarik took up the mantle. He provided a long winded analysis of Obama's online BC and concluded it was a forgery, an assertion he adheres to today.

Except for two things. First, Ron Polarik is a pseudonym for an anonymous internet poster. To date, "Ron" has refused all entreaties to reveal his true identity or credentials. Nor has he agreed to testify in court about his analysis.

Given these facts I ask you: If an anonymous internet poster claimed he had proof your momma was an alligator, would you pay much attention to his assertions? Really, unless Ron is willing to identify himself and his credentials and AGREE TO TESTIFY, his online analysis means nothing. It means as much, legally, as a frog burping in a pond. It certainly is not a smoking gun.

Secondly, you claim the smoking gun is locked away tightly in a vault in Hawaii. But you can't get to it. And may I assume you don't believe the assertions of the Hawaiian Health Dept. officials, Okubo and Fukino?

Suppose I agree with you and say the BC is a smoking gun, despite the fact that neither you nor I have standing to demand to see it. Logically, what you asking me to do is convict him based on a negative. Negatives can't be proven legally. For instance, you could say, "He's an unconvicted sex offender!!!!" and it couldn't be proven either way. Your method would be to believe the assertion and remove him. My method would be to say, "That's no way to prove him ineligible". And, between the two of us, I would be on the side of the law.

Since no law exists which compels him to show us the "smoking gun", again we're faced with a paradox. Some will think him guilty because he doesn't show it. Some, like me, will think he is within his rights as an American not to show it.

In any case, you are trying to remove him by asserting a negative, that is, you haven't seen his BC. Legally, you would lose that fight every time. There is no provision under the law for assuming guilt in such an instance. The fact that he doesn't show you his vault BC isn't a smoking gun.

shadowmongoose72 9 months ago

Yes I heard the tape.And she said she was present at Obama's birth.Now how the heck do you figure she got confused and thought they asked if she was present at the birth of her own son.LMFAO She must be dumb ass all get out to think anyone would wonder if a mother was present when she gave birth.OMFG my side hurts.
Maybe you can tell us all why the kenyan government has locked up Obama'a info and said its a matter of national security.Why exactly would an american presidents info in another country be a matter of national security.Maybe has something to do with the kenyan getting ready to run for governor of california.
I also litened to the interview with the ambassador to in kenya say the hospital he was born in is a national attraction.When asked if they would put up a plaque honoring this ,he said no need everyone knows he was born there.
You know it gets frustrating when people who are suppose to be on your side give up info like that.Guy must be another liar,Just like granny Obama.Seems liars run in this family.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

rulrich: "Blackmonrikker, come on! You want a smoking gun??! Are you a raging lunatic? If the fact that he is hiding his school records, medical records, and long-form birth certificate behind $1 million in lawyer's fees doesn't strike you as some sort of smoking gun, then either you're just naive, plain ignorant, or your one of Obama's minions yourself. "

rulrich, I could go all ad hominem on you. But I won't.

I've addressed the blatantly false $1 million in lawyers fees accusation in numerous posts. That assertion is a flat out lie. The only thing Obama's lawyers have done is file for dismissals. To date, they've received 10-15 of them. At $400/hour that's less than $10K spent. You are repeating a vapid birfer myth.

As far as me being naive or plain ignorant, you may have something there. But I have been following this issue since last October and I have correctly predicted the court's response to EVERY SINGLE CASE SO FAR. I have also been correct when pointing out the legal basis of each judge's opinions.

Compare and contrast that record against the hopeful predictions of the birfers, which have been wrong 100% of the time.

I'll take my record of legal insight every time.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

shadowgoose: "Yes I heard the tape.And she said she was present at Obama's birth.Now how the heck do you figure she got confused and thought they asked if she was present at the birth of her own son.LMFAO She must be dumb ass all get out"

Shadow, what's the president's name? Barack Obama. What's his dad's name? Barack Obama.

Surely you'll give an 86 year old woman some leeway when responding to TWO translators over a patchy phone line.

And in any case, the tape is inadmissible hearsay, so it's really a moot point.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

Come on, guys. You still haven't cited a single current law that supports your position. And yet you've voted my question down 23 times already.

Everything I've said has been based on law. Everything you've said has been based upon the ifs, maybes and suppositions I mentioned in the exegis of this thread.

Are you admitting my thesis about birferism is correct?

dapeoria 9 months ago

Why is the President spending so much to hide his records if there's nothing to hide?

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

dapeoria: "Why is the President spending so much to hide his records if there's nothing to hide? "

I've already answered this question ad nauseum. He's not spending tons of money on birger issues.

But, for the sake of argument, suppose he is? What's illegal about spending money on lawyers? Surely you know that few lawyers are going to complain about that? Even fewer are going to use it as an indictable offense.

I've asked for STRONG LEGAL ARGUMENTS HERE, people. Not standard birfer rhetoric.

Try again.

shadowmongoose72 9 months ago

I think its a joke to say a citizen has no standing.If anyone does the citizens do.

How does the constitution start again?We the PEOPLE.The PEOPLE are the POWER and the PEOPLE have standing.
You know the forefathers wrote the constitution so a fourth grader can understand it.Are you dumber than a fourth grader?Or do you think you are so clever you can say anything you want and its suppose to be true.Stop insulting people's intelligence and stop flattering your self.The law says you must prove you are legal.We do not have to prove you are not.
This guy is a plant by the uscp.You know it and we know it.
I'll tell you what,When the crap hits the blades in this country your pen will not stop the bullets.And your mouth will be shut permanently.
You see,I believe what George Washington wrote about his vision when he claimed to be visited by an angel.Two trials gone and the last coming soon.We will be victorious and people like you will be rotting in one of the seven hell's.Go ahead and laugh now.You can weep for a thousand years later.Wake up guy you are backing the devil.

shadowmongoose72 9 months ago

why do ave4rage people assume they are normal?

creeksneakers2 9 months ago

dapeoria:

What does he have to hide is another way of saying you have no evidence but its up to him to prove your speculation is wrong, and prove it to your unobtainable satisfaction.

eski 9 months ago

Birfer? What the hell's a birfer? And it's not a wild accusation based on "ifs" (whatever that is)it's a serious accusation based on fact. A long form if the birth certificate is required to verify citizenship even in Hawaii where it is supposedly on file. Why will he not release the long form and why has Obama assembled a full legal team to field this issue. If it is so open and shut he'd just produce the damn thing and be done with it. I think he knows damn good and well that he's not a natural born citizen and he's covering it up. The smoking gun is the fact that he won't produce the required document. John McCain had to produce more proof of citizenship than Obama and he's a certified war hero of the United States with a long history of public service to our country.

photosrme 9 months ago

To: blackmonrikker:

There is no supposition to what Obama (or his campaign) posted on his website being a fake. The posted image itself clearly states it is a "Certification of Live Birth"; NOT a "Certificate of Live Birth" or a "Birth Certificate".
Link: http://fightthesmears.com/articles/5/birthcertificate

Mr. Obama's website posted a misleading caption, knowing that most people would never realize there were two types of COLBs and/or know the critical differences. Let alone know that around the time of Mr. Obama's birth, the state of Hawaii would issue a "Certification of Live Birth" for a child that was NOT born in Hawaii.

The image posted on Obama's website is a lower resolution version that was first posted on the DailyKos website. The DailyKos initially would not state where they got the image from. At some point DailyKos acknowledge they got the image from a 3rd party not associated with Mr. Obama.

The DailyKos image, provided by the 3rd-party, was traced back to one of several "like" images posted on PhotoBucket. Now, even if the image was of a Certificate, there is no legal chain-of-custody for the image. It also brings up the question of just how did this 3rd-party get a supposed "copy" of the short-form, if the state of Hawaii will only provide copies to Mr. Obama?

Just for an exercise, let us suppose for a minute that the image posted on Mr. Obama's website actually stated it was a "Certificate of Live Birth" and the supposed image first appeared there in the original high-resolution version.
- Why should citizens believe that the image is the real thing, when the person making the claim refuses to produce the original for inspection? OR
- Why should citizens take a person's word that something is as he/she claims, when the person has been deceptive with his/her past claims?

Put more bluntly: Would you buy a used car from a person who claims the car is in perfect running order, will only show you an image of the car, and will not let you test drive the car?

BTW: Your all-caps question is cleverly loaded - as such:
Where can we see a certified legal copy of Mr. Obama's Certificate of Live Birth that would make "NORMAL" Americans, such as myself, agree Mr. Obama meets the eligibility requirements to be POTUS as set forth by the Constitution?? ;)

Politely,
Photosrme

photosrme 9 months ago

To blackmonrikker:

"Some, like me, will think he is within his rights as an American not to show it."
-------------------------------------------------
Which "right" would that be?
Could you point to that "right" in the Constitution or Amendments?

-------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------

"Legally, you would lose that fight every time. There is no provision under the law for assuming guilt in such an instance."
-------------------------------------------------
I disagree with your assessment for three reasons.
1) Mr. Obama, being a Constitutional Lawyer knew of the eligibility requirements to be POTUS as set forth in the Constitution. As such, Mr. Obama had no reasonable expectation that he would not be required to provide proof of him being a "natural born citizen" of the United States.
2)The position of POTUS is not a protected right. No one is guaranteed they will be President; the position is one a person can be elected too. The position is also one in which the person serves his/her country, not the other way around.
3) Going by your assessment, please tell us:
- how the federal government can legally require citizens to provide a government issued photo-id when flying commercial? And
- how the federal government can put a citizen on the "No Fly List" without even a trial? And
- how the federal government can legally require citizens to provide their "Certificate of Live Birth" or long-form of their "Birth Certificate" to get a mere passport?

Sincerely,
Photosrme

phylmike34 9 months ago

Below please find a special message from one of our advertisers, United States Justice Foundation. From time to time, we receive opportunities we believe you as a valued customer may want to know about. Please note that the following message does not necessarily reflect the editorial positions of Human Events.

Dear Friend of the Constitution,

Update on The biggest political cover up in American history

Worse than Watergate, Whitewatergate, or any of the other cover ups of previous administrations, is the question of whether Barack Hussein Obama is eligible to serve as President of the United States of America... OR, is he a FRAUD, a USURPER, a man with no legal authority to sit in the position that he now claims to hold?

Barack Obama could simply put the issue to rest RIGHT NOW by releasing his ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE! But he WON'T! Instead, he has had teams of attorneys all over the country, fighting "tooth and nail" to thwart the efforts of the United States Justice Foundation (USJF), and our allies in a number of states, to compel him to produce an ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE and to prove that he is Constitutionally eligible to serve as President of these United States!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

Ohio, Mississippi, Hawaii, and California! These are the states where USJF has been involved in lawsuits seeking an answer to this critical constitutional question!

And now, in California, just like in every lawsuit filed over this issue, the Obama team of attorneys, working with liberal allies in the office of California Attorney General Jerry Brown, has convinced a Sacramento County Superior Court judge to dismiss USJF's suit to force the truth to come out about whether Barack Obama is a "natural born" citizen, and, therefore, eligible to serve as President of the United States.

BUT WE'RE NOT GIVING UP! Our clients in this case, including 2008 candidate for President of the United States, Alan Keyes, have given USJF the go ahead to file an appeal of this decision!

AND THAT'S WHAT WE ARE GOING TO DO -- BUT WE NEED YOUR HELP TO DO IT!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

A number of apologists for Barack Obama have gone to great lengths to belittle USJF and our allies in the fight to preserve our Constitution. However, the questions that they cannot answer are:

If Barack Hussein Obama has nothing to hide, WHY doesn't he just make his real birth certificate public? WHY has he spent a almost $900,000.00 in attorney fees, for, among other things, fighting USJF's efforts to obtain his ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE? The more that he fights these efforts to see this document, the more that you have to wonder, WHY?

Obama supporters want everyone to believe that only "fringies," the people that they now call "birthers," in other words, only people that they claim are outside of the main stream of thinking, question whether Mr. Obama is truly eligible to serve as President of the United States of America. But the truth of the matter is that more and more people, including many federal, state, and local elected officials, AND many in the military, are questioning whether Barack Hussein Obama is, indeed, a "natural born citizen," a Constitutional requirement for him to serve as President of these United States.

The citizens of this country have the right to know if Barack Obama is, indeed, eligible to serve as President! And we here at the United States Justice Foundation are going to take our lawsuit all the way up to the United States Supreme Court, if that is what is necessary, to find out the answer to this critical question.

This fight to discover the truth will be neither easy nor inexpensive, but isn't protecting the Constitution worth it? And that is exactly what this legal battle is all about,

PROTECTING THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

Barack Obama wants you to ignore what he is doing, he wants you to ignore the U.S. Constitution, he wants you to think that the parts of the Constitution that he does not agree with (like the requirements to serve as President) are unimportant.

In effect, he wants to destroy the U. S. Constitution and reshape this country into his own image of what he wants it to be.

And Barack Obama's attorneys have now taken another big step to destroy the Constitution of the United States -- this time in a California State Court. Those attorneys, working with liberal California State Attorney General Jerry Brown, convinced the Judge in our case to rule that only Members of Congress can challenge the qualifications of Mr. Obama, or any candidate, to serve as President.

And, the Judge further ruled that such a challenge could only be made on the 6th day of January following the meeting of the Presidential electors, at the session of Congress where the vote of the Electoral College is counted and the results announced. To use the Judge's words, this is "the exclusive means for challenges to the qualifications of President..."

That means that no one, except a Member of Congress, and only on one certain day of the year following the Presidential election, can challenge the qualifications of a President-Elect! And then, the challenge can only be successful if a majority of the Members of Congress support the challenge! And that means that the politicians, not the people, are in control of who becomes President if there is an eligibility issue!

Is that what you want? Do you believe that the majority party in both Houses of Congress should be deciding who is eligible to serve as President? Do you want Ted Kennedy, Nancy Pelosi, or Harry Reid deciding who is President?

That means that the requirements of the U. S. Constitution as to the eligibility of the man or woman who runs for President to serve as President are meaningless!

Do you believe that the Constitution is a meaningless document? Do you believe that a majority of the Members of Congress have the right to ignore it? To render it of no force and effect?

The Trial Court Judge in our case did! But we are not going to accept his decision. We are not going to accept the legal arguments made by Barack Hussein Obama's attorneys, and those by attorneys from liberal California Attorney General Jerry Brown. We are going to keep fighting this monumentally important legal battle all the way up to the United States Supreme Court, if that is what is necessary.

IT'S A BATTLE THAT WE MUST FIGHT!

IT'S A BATTLE THAT WE MUST WIN!

IT'S A BATTLE THAT WILL DECIDE WHETHER THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA WILL REMAIN A CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC, OR WHETHER WE WILL JOIN THE DUST HEAP OF HISTORY AS JUST ANOTHER FAILED EXPERIMENT!

USJF IS IN A BATTLE THAT COULD CHANGE THE HISTORY OF OUR GREAT COUNTRY! -- but we need YOUR help to WIN!

IT'S A BATTLE TO SAVE OUR CONSTITUTION!

IT'S A BATTLE TO SAVE OUR COUNTRY!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

We MUST learn the truth about whether Barack Obama is a "natural born citizen!

But to blunt our efforts to learn the truth, the Trial Court also blocked our subpoena for the college records of Mr. Obama! These vital records could have proven whether Barack Hussein Obama is eligible to serve as President of the United States, or whether he is a USURPER, a FRAUD, sitting in the oval office without any legal authority to do so!

What is in those records? We do not know. But the Obama legal team pulled out all of the stops to block the subpoena, so we believe that there is something in those college records that bears on the critical issue of whether Barack Obama is eligible to serve as President of the United States.

JUST LIKE WE BELIEVE THAT THERE IS A REASON WHY THE OBAMA LEGAL TEAM, ACCORDING TO A PUBLISHED REPORT, HAS BEEN PAID OVER $800,000.00, and as much as almost $900,000.00, TO KEEP THE PUBLIC FROM SEEING HIS REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE -- NOT THE PHONEY ONE THAT HE PUT UP ON HIS WEBSITE.

There is no doubt in my mind that this e-mail may be the one of the most important documents that you ever read!

What you do after reading this e-mail may well determine the fate of the United States of America!

Please know that we are not saying that Barack Hussein Obama is not eligible to serve as President of the United States of America. The problem is we just do not know!

We do know that Barack Obama's maternal step-grandmother has proclaimed that she was present at his birth in Mombasa, in what is now Kenya, in Africa!

We do know that a fake birth certificate was put up on Obama's website!

We do know that Mr. Obama's legal team is doing everything that it can, in every case filed over this issue; to make sure that no one has access to his birth certificate.

We do know that Mr. Obama's legal team is doing everything that it can, in our California case; to make sure that no one has access to his college records.

DON'T LET THEM GET AWAY WITH IT!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

The voters of the United States of America have the right to know whether Barack Obama is a "natural born citizen," as REQUIRED by the U. S. Constitution!

It's a question that MUST be answered!

Why? Because, if an unqualified person was elected to the Office of President of the United States, our entire form of government could be compromised!

Why?

Because, if Barack Hussein Obama is not eligible to serve as President of the United States, each and every act that he takes as President will be null and void! That's right, each bill that he signs into law, every Executive Order that he issues, and each and every one of his nominations to his Cabinet and to the federal courts will have no legal effect!

I don't make that statement lightly. It's not an exaggeration.

Article 2, Section 1, Clause 4 of the United States Constitution provides, in pertinent part, as follows: "No Person except a natural born Citizen... shall be eligible to the Office of President..."

That means that neither Osama Bin Laden, nor California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, nor Obama billionaire money man George Soros can serve as President of the United States. That also means that if Barack Obama was born outside of the United States, he is not eligible to serve as President of our great country!

So where was Mr. Obama born?

He claims to have a copy of his birth certificate. That means that either he knows where he was born, or he's lying about having that document.

And only Barack Hussein Obama's ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE can answer that question of where he was born. But he has teams of attorneys, all across the country, spending, and doing, whatever it takes to make sure that no one, and I mean NO ONE, will be allowed to see the one document that can clear up this controversy

Mr. Obama has claimed that his Presidential administration will be the most transparent in history. Yet, he will not make public the one document that could end all of the questions about the legitimacy of his election as President.

And you have to ask yourself, WHY?

Is it because this is some unimportant "technicality"? No, a requirement of the U. S. Constitution is not a mere "technicality"!

Is it because "President" Obama (if he is the President of the United States) has more important issues to deal with, and can't spare the time to deal with such a trivial issue? No, what is more important than the integrity of the Office of the President?

Or, is there something more involved?

Another question that the Obamaphiles don't want to answer is why, in 2005, was a law firm with ties to Mr. Obama researching the question as to how to evade the requirements of Article II of the United States Constitution, regarding the requirements to serve as President. 2005? Three years before the Presidential campaign?

If that doesn't raise questions in your mind, then nothing will!

And then there's the statements made by representatives of the State of Hawaii!

According to Dr. Chiyome Fukino, of the State of Hawaii's Department of Health,
"Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawaii, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawaii State Department of Health has Sen. Obama's original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."
Exactly what does that mean? If she can access it, why can't we? It is that very record that USJF financed lawsuits in Mississippi and in Hawaii were seeking to force into the public arena! But Obama's attorneys, and his allies in state government, stopped those efforts cold!

So, the time of decision is now!

Do we give up?

Do we just ignore this threat to our Constitution? To our very form of government?

We here at USJF say NO!

Now is not the time to give up this fight!

Now is not the time to walk away from the most important Constitutional battle in our lifetime!

Now is the time to redouble our efforts to find out the truth!

Now is the time to tell Barack Hussein Obama that the United States Constitution is far more important than his political ambition!

But we can only do this with your help! With your financial support, and with the financial support of everyone that you know!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

Will you stand with us?

Sincerely,

Gary Kreep, Executive Director
United States Justice Foundation

P.S. This is the biggest political cover-up in American history! It would be so simple to release the documents to PROVE Obama is a natural-born citizen... IF THEY HAD THE DOCUMENTS!

Barack Hussein Obama thinks he can get away with DUPING the American people and DESTROYING the U.S. Constitution. DON'T LET HIM DO IT!

HELP US EXPOSE THE OBAMA COVER-UP -- DON'T LET HIM
RIP OUR CONSTITUTION TO SHREDS!

To donate by check, please mail to:
United States Justice Foundation
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Robert Laity 9 months ago

The constitution is clear that our POTUS must be "Natural-born". That means he or she must be born in the United States of america. Over the years this pre-requisite has been eroded to include children of american parents born elsewhere and other citations about being born at sea. The key is to have TWO american parents. Obama does not. In addition,there are issues with dual citizenship. Obama's purported mother Stanley Dunham did NOT meet citizenship requirements at the time of Obama's purported birth in Hawaii. Obama,Sr was a British citizen and also married to other women in Kenya at the time he married Dunham. A COLB, a certificate of live birth,is available in Hawaii to anyone who proves he was born alive. One does NOT have to be born in Hawaii to get one. The COLB has been found to be a forgery. A BC is a birth certificate. Obama has NOT produced one. Hawaii stated that it has one "On record" but failed to state publicy if that BC asserts obama's purported birth in Hawaii. There has been ample testimony,ignored by the main stream media,that Obama was born in Kenya. These facts inject a very serious issue into the mix. Is Obama our bona-fide POTUS or MUST he step down?

evreport 9 months ago

Examination of taped interview with Obama’s African step-grandmother, performed by Gregory Doudna:

The full tape transcription makes clear that this phone conversation has not been represented accurately. There never was a statement by Sarah Obama at any point in this phone call saying or intending to say that Barack Obama Jr. was born in Kenya. Sarah Obama herself said that Obama was born in Hawaii and never said differently. There was a confusion over the meaning of where Mrs. Obama was “present” when Obama was born in Hawaii, but not over whether Obama was born in Hawaii.

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/obamatranscriptlulu109.pdf

Robert Laity 9 months ago

The Kenyan Ambassador conceded Obama was born in Kenya. His Grandmother's conversation was recorded for posterity.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

shadowmongoose72: "I think its a joke to say a citizen has no standing.If anyone does the citizens do."

Again, you are relying on what you THINK. "Standing" is hardened case law. If it were not, every time a liberal was elected he would be harried by millions of lawsuits from conservatives who thought he'd wronged them. And vice versa when a conservative was elected. Your position against "standing" is essentially a position against majority rule. It's sour grapes. You'll never win that fight. Again, you have not offered a law to support your case, only wishful thinking.

"This guy is a plant by the uscp.You know it and we know it."

I know no such thing. And neither do you. You THINK it. But you have no proof that will stand up in court.

photosrme: "There is no supposition to what Obama (or his campaign) posted on his website being a fake. The posted image itself clearly states it is a "Certification of Live Birth"; NOT a "Certificate of Live Birth" or a "Birth Certificate"."

Yes, but he has the backing on the relevant authorities in Hawaii on that one. He posted what they sent him. They claim the COLB is legal for any and all federal requirements of a BC. You may not think so. But, again, you haven't posted any law that supports your assertion. And Dr. Okubo and Dr. Fukino have held several press conferences supporting the legality of Obama's Hawaiian COLB.

eski: "A long form if the birth certificate is required to verify citizenship even in Hawaii where it is supposedly on file."

There is no such thing as a long form BC, according to Hawaiian DOH official Dr. Okubo. She disputes and directly contradicts your assertion here. Since she is the subject matter expert on the matter, I'm fairly sure her legal testimony will outweigh your assertion here.

Still not a single law cited that Obama is breaking. WHERE'S THE SMOKING GUN?!??????

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

Photosrme asked:

"3) Going by your assessment, please tell us:
- how the federal government can legally require citizens to provide a government issued photo-id when flying commercial? And
- how the federal government can put a citizen on the "No Fly List" without even a trial? And
- how the federal government can legally require citizens to provide their "Certificate of Live Birth" or long-form of their "Birth Certificate" to get a mere passport?

Sincerely,
Photosrme"

How can they do this legally? They simply say do it or (1) you can't fly and (2) you'll go to jail.

Every law and rule is based on the consent of the governer, photosrme. If enough people object to being carded for flights, the law would change. The same is true for the "standing" law and most of the things you object to about Obama.

The problem is, YOU ARE IN THE MINORITY. 66% of the nation would vote against you. You are being overly ambitious by claiming "We the People" status. Be honest. Call yourselves "We, the 20% of the nation that dislike the president" or even more accurately "We birfers, the 0.5% of the electorate that believe the president to be ineligible".

It's unlikely you'll get enough votes to change the laws that are currently propping up President Obama.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

Robert Laity: "The Kenyan Ambassador conceded Obama was born in Kenya. His Grandmother's conversation was recorded for posterity. "

Suppose I concede the Kenyan Ambassador's statement. Suppose the Pope and the Queen of England make the same statement. Suppose Billy Graham weighs in and says Obama was born in Kenya.

NONE OF THOSE STATEMENTS HOLD WEIGHT UNDER U.S. LAW. NONE OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE SUBJECT MATTER EXPERTS ON HAWAIIAN BIRTH CERTIFICATES. As long as the Hawaiian Department of Health says Obama was born in Hawaii, Jesus Christ himself doesn't have standing, under U.S. law, to contradict them.

I've asked for you birfers to work within the law. So far, you have not. WHERE'S THE SMOKING GUN?!??!???

Robert Laity 9 months ago

Concede that Obama must produce his real BC. Jesus does have standing since "n God we trust",not Allah! You consider yourself "Normal"? Is it normal to allow usurpation of the Presidency?

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

Robert Laity: "Concede that Obama must produce his real BC. Jesus does have standing since "n God we trust",not Allah! You consider yourself "Normal"? Is it normal to allow usurpation of the Presidency? "

Have you cited a law or a legal principle anywhere in this? No? I don't see one.

OK, I concede Obama must show his real BC. My concession holds NO LEGAL WEIGHT. My name is not Hillary Clinton, nor is it John McCain. Truth be told, if you want to make some legal headway you have to recruit a 2008 presidential candidate with standing to sue. Try Alan Keyes. Oh wait, you've already got him onboard. How's that working out for you?

photosrme 9 months ago

To blackmonrikker:

The Smoking Gun you have asked for has been delivered by several here. Must be like the forest for the trees...

How about you cite a legal principle that says Mr. Obama is exempt from the eligibility requirements to legally be POTUS as set forth by the Constitution??

-----------------------------------------
"How can they do this legally? They simply say do it or (1) you can't fly and (2) you'll go to jail."
-----------------------------------------
Thanks by the way for acknowledging that your attempt at using, innocent until prove guilty, does not apply to Mr. Obama's requirement to prove he is a "natural born citizen".

As to your statement of: "There is no such thing as a long form BC, according to Hawaiian DOH official ...", well you are wrong. There is a long-form known as "Certificate of Live Birth" and short-form known as "Certification of Live Birth".

In regard to your statement of: "They claim the COLB is legal for any and all federal requirements of a BC", -- post links to where they actually made such statements. Additionally, post links where the Federal government acknowledges that the state of Hawaii can dictate what the Federal government accepts.

"But, again, you haven't posted any law that supports your assertion." Actually, I have in two previous posts. But you have chosen to ignore those posts. Hawaiian law does not recognize the short-form for all legal purposes and in some cases requires the person to provide the long-form.
But here it is once again: http://hawaii.gov/dhhl/applicants/appforms/applyhhl
-----------------------------------------------
"In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."
-----------------------------------------------
Note: This also shows Hawaii does have a long form version, despite your claim.

As for this: "It's unlikely you'll get enough votes to change the laws that are currently propping up President Obama." That is a misnomer of a statement. We do not need to change any laws. Mr. Obama is managing to avoid and/or skirt the laws. Of course, given Mr. Obama's position and past behavior, I would expect nothing less.

Sincerely,
Photosrme

photosrme 9 months ago

Said by blackmonrikker: "As long as the Hawaiian Department of Health says Obama was born in Hawaii, ..."
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------

The Hawaiian Dept. of Health has never stated Mr. Obama was actually born in Hawaii. Numerous press writers however have taken what DR. Fukino wrote in a letter dated 10/31/08, and tried to extrapolate such a claim. The following is what Dr. Fukino stated in writing.
----------------
"Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."
----------------
No where does Dr. Fukino state in that letter Mr. Obama was born in Hawaii. Nor does Dr. Fukino say what the Department has on file is the long-form or short-form version, or if the form on file is even from Hawaii.

All we know is there is some form filed in "accordance with state policies and procedures". Which could mean the form for Mr. Obama is in a sealed folder, stored in a fire resistant cabinet, in alphabetical order.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

photosrme: "In regard to your statement of: "They claim the COLB is legal for any and all federal requirements of a BC", -- post links to where they actually made such statements"

Here you go:

http://www.starbulletin.com/columnists/kokualine/20090606_kokua_line.html

Dr. Okubo: "Asked for more information about the short-form versus long-form birth documents, Okubo said the Health Department "does not have a short-form or long-form certificate."

"The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models," she said."

Happy?

rulrich 9 months ago

Blackmonrikker, the issue here is really very simple. Very simple. Yet you continue to sidetrack the central issue with your ad ignoratium arguments, as does the silenced media and corrupt legal system. The truth will eventually come out, however.

Obama has multiple problems that he must explain. The long form birth certificate vs COLB is only one of many problems that he has repeatedly avoided. All of the following must be proven for Obama not to have broken constitutional law.

1)He must prove he was born in Hawaii.
2)He must prove he was NOT a dual citizen at birth.
3)He must prove he did not renounce citizenship by going to school in Indonesia as a child.
4)He must prove he never had a foreign passport to travel abroad to Pakistan in 1981.
5)He must prove that he never received financial aid as a foreign Fullbright scholar to Occidental College.

These ALL must be proven. Yet they still remain unanswered. Obama's refusal to address these problems is more of a damning indictment against him already, not a smoking gun.

I repeat that you either are naive, ignorant, or corrupt. Possibly all three.

kandis1105 9 months ago

The Birth Certificate is a non-issue. It’s the Constitution that’s the Issue.

Some historical quotes about Natural Born Citizen, and facts about Vattel (Law of Nations), and the Constitution. (I know that some know what NBC means)

About Vattel (Law of Nations), and the Constituion

http://blog.barofintegrity.us/2008/12/13/law-of-nations-or-principles-of-the-law-of-nature-applies-to-the-conduct--affairs-of-nations--sovereigns.aspx

- Emmerich de Vattel's The Law of Nations was key in framing the United States as the world's first constitutional republic.

- The Law of Nations was crucial in shaping American thinking about the nature of constitutions.

“Law of Nations” Book One, Chapter 19, 212 (1758)
http :// www. constitution.org/vattel/vattel_01.htm

“The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights. The society is supposed to desire this, in consequence of what it owes to its own preservation; and it is presumed, as matter of course, that each citizen, on entering into society, reserves to his children the right of becoming members of it. The country of the fathers is therefore that of the children; and these become true citizens merely by their tacit consent. We shall soon see whether, on their coming to the years of discretion, they may renounce their right, and what they owe to the society in which they were born. I say, that, in order to be of the country, it is necessary that a person be born of a father who is a citizen; for, if he is born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of his birth, and not his country."

Boston revolutionary leader Samuel Adams wrote in 1772, "Vattel tells us plainly and without hesitation, that 'the supreme legislative cannot change the constitution,' 'that their authority does not extend so far,' and 'that they ought to consider the fundamental laws as sacred, if the nation has not, in very express terms, given them power to change them.' " In a debate with the Colonial Governor of Massachusetts, in 1773, John Adams quoted Vattel that the parliament does not have the power to change the constitution.

Natural Born Citizen

http://constitutionallyspeaking.wordpress.com/2009/06/04/whiplash-syndrome-feverishly-sweeping-the-nation/

- Historical Fact #3 Additionally, in 1800, Charles Pinckney ( Continental Congress (1777-78 and 1784-87) and S.C. state legislature (1779-80, 1786-89, and 1792-96) said the presidential eligibility clause was designed “to insure…attachment to the country”:

“What better way to insure attachment to the country than to require the President to have his American citizenship through his American Father and not through a foreign father. Any child can be born anywhere in the country and be removed by their father to be raised in his native country. The risks would be for the child to return later in life to reside in this country bringing with him foreign influences and intrigues.”

- Historical #4 Further research brings us to St. George Tucker (Fourteenth and Fifteenth Congresses (March 4, 1815-March 3, 1819); chairman, Committee on District of Columbia (Fourteenth Congress), Committee on Expenditures on Public Buildings (Fifteenth Congress); author of Tucker’s Commentaries and of a treatise on natural law and on the formation of the Constitution of the United States and State senate, 1819-1823; chancellor of the fourth judicial district of Virginia 1824-1831):

“The Provision in the Constitution which requires that the President shall be a “natural born” citizen, unless he were a citizen of the United States when the Constitution was adopted, is a happy means of security against foreign influence, which, wherever it is capable of being exerted, is to be dreaded more than the plague. The admission of foreigners into our councils, consequently, cannot be too much guarded against; their total exclusion from a station to which foreign nations have been accustomed to, attach ideas of sovereign power, sacredness of character, and hereditary right, is a measure of the most consummate policy and wisdom.

The title of king, prince, emperor, or czar, without the smallest addition to his powers, would render him a member of a fraternity of the crowned heads: their common cause has more than once threatened the desolation of Europe. To have added a member to this sacred family in America, would have invited and perpetuated among us all the evils of Pandora’s Box.”

- In 1866, under Sec. 1992 of the revised statutes, the same Congress confirmed and adopted as law the principle in regards to determining citizenship at the time of birth:

“All persons born in the United States and not subject to any foreign power, excluding Indians not taxed, are declared to be “citizens” of the United States.”[note the word citizen, not “natural born citizen”}

Rep. Bingham commenting on Sec. 1992 said during debate on the difference between ‘natural born” and ‘born” citizenships under the 14th Amendment:

“It means every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of “parents” [emphasis plural] not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of our Constitution itself, a “natural born” citizen.”
14th Amendment (Wong Kim Ark Case, 1868)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wong_Kim_Ark

- The Wong Kim Ark case dealt with him becoming a U.S. CITIZEN (about age 20) due to his foreign parents, under the 14th Amendment.
NOT AT BIRTH, NOT AMERICAN PARENTS - He (Ark) could not be President. Maybe his kids and grandkids, if they were born in the US, and married an American spouse.

Obama’s Admission

- He has admitted that his father is Kenyan
- He admitts he took his fathers citizenship at birth due to the British Nationality Act of 1948…on his fightthesmears webpage
- He was born with duel citizenship British and American.
- Look back at previous quotes about foreigners and fathers.
- Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5. Requirement to be President has not changed since the drafting of the Constitution NATURAL BORN CITIZEN
- His father disqualifies him no matter where he was born.

phylmike34 9 months ago

Obama's 'birth certificate' not acceptable in Hawaii?
Even state requires long-form document for some eligibility, identification issues
Posted: June 07, 2009
4:10 pm Eastern

© 2009 WorldNetDaily

From the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands website

WASHINGTON – The Hawaiian certification of live birth Barack Obama posted on his campaign website and distributed to select news organizations as proof he was a "natural born citizen" would not be accepted as a "birth certificate" even for some Hawaiian state government eligibility issues, WND has learned.

The investigation follows a Honolulu Star Bulletin column Saturday, which quotes a state Department of Health spokeswoman as saying the state's current certification of live birth is recognized "as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements."

The website of the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands, however, states clearly the certification of live birth touted by the Obama campaign, White House press secretary Robert Gibbs and a host of other Obama defenders is not acceptable as a form of identification to qualify under this program.

As WND has reported, certifications of live birth were widely issued to Hawaiians born in foreign countries in 1961, the year Obama was born.

Are you motivated yet to join the billboard campaign and clear up the air of mystery surrounding Barack Obama's constitutional eligibility to serve?

The Star Bulletin column goes on to report: "The issue of what constitutes an official Hawaii birth certificate received national attention during last year's presidential campaign. Those who doubted Barack Obama's American citizenship called the copy of the Hawaii birth document posted on his campaign website a fake."

However, Obama's "citizenship" was never the question raised during the campaign or after the election. The issue raised by WND has consistently been that Obama failed to prove he was actually born in Hawaii and thus constitutionally qualified to become president as a "natural born citizen" – which requires that the birth took place in the United States.

The qualifications for the Hawaiian Home Lands program require a certified copy of a standard birth certificate – also known as the "long-form certificate" filled out in the hospital and including details such as the name of the hospital and the attending physician.

"In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate of Live Birth, which is either black or green," the qualifications state. "This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate of Live Birth will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL."

According to Hawaii's Department of Health spokeswoman Janice Okubo, the state only issues "certifications" of live births since 2001 when the health department went paperless. It is only available in electronic form, she said.

"At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting," she is quoted as telling the Star Bulletin. "The electronic record of the birth is what (the Health Department) now keeps on file in order to provide same-day certified copies at our help window for most requests," Okubo said.

She did not explain how those needing a standard long-form birth certificate to qualify for programs such as those offered by the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands or to establish proof of eligibility to be president could be fulfilled. She said the U.S. Supreme Court has recognized the state's current certification of live birth "as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements." She did not, however, cite any specific rulings, and the Supreme Court has not taken up the issue of whether the certification of live birth would qualify a presidential candidate as eligible under the "natural born citizen" clause
Many of members of the public commenting on the Star Bulletin column raised similar questions:

"I'm fifty years old and I need to apply for a passport," wrote one. "So I scan some representation of COLB onto my Facebook page. If I take my laptop to the DMV, can I just open my laptop to show my web page to the clerk who will then verify my citizenship and issue me a legal passport? I'm sorry but some documents need a paper trail."

"To be president you need to be a 'natural born citizen,'" said another. "That means you are born in this country of 'parents that are citizens.' Note that both 'parent' and 'citizen' are plural. His father was a British subject and, yes, under the laws of both the United States and the UK at the time [when] he was born, Obama's citizenship was passed by descent of the father. These are the facts. We have laws and no one is above them."

"There seems to be a great deal of secrecy surrounding this whole situation," said another. "I've read that he has three legal teams keeping his info private. He has also had all his college records sealed. So this is transparency and change? Why all the mystery?"
Additional controversy over where Obama was born came when the woman the president says is his paternal grandmother, Sarah Obama, claimed to have been present at her grandson's birth in Mombasa, Kenya.

Joseph Farah, WND editor and chief executive officer, launched a national billboard campaign last month in an effort to keep the issue before the American people. The billboards, being leased around the country, ask the simple question, "Where's the birth certificate?" Farah is asking the public to support his campaign with donations. So far, more than $75,000 has been collected.

Last week, CBS, the largest provider of outdoor advertising in the country, announced it would refuse requests for space for the campaign. But Farah says CBS' refusal to lease space for the campaign will not hinder it.

"There are plenty of other billboard companies willing and eager to take our money," said Farah. "The only obstacle to this campaign is raising the money necessary to make it truly a national phenomenon."

The billboard campaign followed one launched months earlier to collect the names on an electronic petition demanding accountability and transparency on the issue. So far, that petition has gathered nearly 400,000 names.

The campaign got a boost last week when WND White House correspondent Les Kinsolving asked Obama's press secretary, Robert Gibbs, why the president wouldn't release his birth certificate. Gibbs' response was covered live on C-SPAN and by Fox News Channel and others – excluding CBS.

It was the first time any member of the press corps has publicly asked a member of the administration a question directly related to Obama's constitutional eligibility for office as a "natural born citizen."

Congressional hearings were held to determine whether Sen. John McCain was constitutionally eligible to be president as a "natural born citizen," but no controlling legal authority ever sought to verify Obama's claim to a Hawaiian birth.

Both the petition and the billboard campaign are part of what Farah calls an independent "truth and transparency campaign."

The first sign to be posted under the campaign, a digital, electronic one, is up and online on Highway 165 in Ball, La. – the result of a donation by the owner. In addition, based on the heavy volume of financial donations in the first days of the campaign, WND was able to commit to leasing three more standard billboards – one in Los Angeles, another in Orange County, Calif. and a third in Pennsylvania.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

rulrich: "Obama has multiple problems that he must explain. The long form birth certificate vs COLB is only one of many problems that he has repeatedly avoided. All of the following must be proven for Obama not to have broken constitutional law.

1)He must prove he was born in Hawaii.
2)He must prove he was NOT a dual citizen at birth.
3)He must prove he did not renounce citizenship by going to school in Indonesia as a child.
4)He must prove he never had a foreign passport to travel abroad to Pakistan in 1981.
5)He must prove that he never received financial aid as a foreign Fullbright scholar to Occidental College.

These ALL must be proven. Yet they still remain unanswered. Obama's refusal to address these problems is more of a damning indictment against him already, not a smoking gun.

I repeat that you either are naive, ignorant, or corrupt. Possibly all three."

And yet you've still not mentioned a single law to support your contentions. Why? You can't.

And that's why you'll continue to be ignored. I may be naive, corrupt and ignorant, but I am one more thing that you are not. I'm right.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

kandis1105,

I've already noted that I am conflicted about the legal definition of NBC. Your assertions dovetail with my own FEELINGS about the matter. However, there is a wealth of case law that shows the merely being born on American soil is good enough to be NBC.

This is the one issue that birfers could hammer and maybe get some closure. But, again, whatever the SCOTUS decides on the matter won't apply to Obama retroactively. You won't be able to get him out of office with the two-parent NBC argument. At best, you'll only prevent him from running in 2012.

photosrme 9 months ago

Hello blackmonrriker:

Thank you for posting the link to the article. It was written just this Saturday and I was not aware of the article.

----------------------------------
Ms. Okubo is quoted as saying: "She added that the U.S. Supreme Court has recognized the state's current certification of live birth "as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements."
----------------------------------
However, I have not found where the U.S. Supreme Court has made such a ruling or heard such a case before the court. Maybe Ms. Okubo meant Hawaii's Supreme Court?

As for being "Happy"? No, just confused with the conflicting information from state of Hawaii's own web pages discussing two different forms, the previous statements by Hawaii's Dept. of Health, and now the statements in this article.

What is becoming clear -- there needs to be a legal investigation into the matter. One where people are required to provide proof of their claims and statements, along with them being called as witnesses to provide testimony under oath. For the good of this country, the facts and fiction of this entire matter needs to be resolved.

Sincerely,
Photosrme

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

photosrme,

Thank you for your reasonable tone. I tend to be less snarky and more reasonable in response to reason.

I, too, would like to have these issues looked into. I take issue with the demanding tone that the birfers use when referencing the president. Like me, he's probably flipping most birfers off. But given a more rational tone, you may get that which you seek.

Again, there exists no current law which requires him to respond. That's been my entire point. Most birfers think they can get what they want by shouting him down. They cannot. Only the law can compel President Obama to respond to you.

He believes he HAS responded. He also believes that the birfer movement is politically motivated. He believes that most birfers aren't going to vote for him anyway, so why cater to their wishes? You will admit that most Americans don't know or care about this issue.

I would suggest that you write you congressman and get him to submit a bill which closes the vetting loophole for presidential candidates. First, there needs to be an agency that examines credentials. Currently none exists.

Its unlikely that you will hamstring Obama's current presidency with this issue. All the hoopla about invalidating his laws, treaties and appointments is pure hogwash.

In order to win the election in 2012, you may want to start hyping a valid opponent now, instead of wasting you energy trying to bring down a president based on his birth certificate.

I'm not trying to discourage you. But, really, if you dislike his first four years, what you are doing isn't likely to impede his second administration. Really, you may think you are patriots, but most people are laughing.

kandis1105 9 months ago

blackmonrikker,

Can you please cite some of the:

"wealth of case law that shows the merely being born on American soil is good enough to be NBC"

We've only heard Obama say that he was born in Hawaii but was he really. Just quotes and on record.

From the Kenyan National Assembley
November 5, 2008 (p. 3275-8

http://www:scribd.com/doc/9606845/Kenyan-National-Assembly-Wednesday-5th-November-200851108A

Ms. Odhiambo: … Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the President-elect, Mr, Obama, is a son of the soil of this country. Every other country in this continent is celebrating the Obama win. It is only proper and fitting that the country which he originates from should show the same excitement, pomp and colour. (p.3275)-----son of soil of this country, and originates.

Mr. Deputy Speaker: President-elect has not been sworn-in yet. The election of President-elect Obama is of utmost national importance to the United States of America. Ms. Odhiambo, you are a lawyer. You had better be careful where you transgress between watching your own sovereignty and what can be interpreted in some quarters as some form of treason. (p. 3276)----Obama did have Kenyan citizenship for a few years.

At the beginning of this year, Senator Barrack Obama called me at midnight and told me: “Mr. Vice President, could you make sure you sort out this problem?” I want to assure him that the problem has since been sorted out. (p. 3277-8)-----What problem? Birth Certificate, money contributions (illegal)

creeksneakers2 9 months ago

Would Kandis and blackmonrikker mind if I butt in?

This fundamental principle, with these qualifications or or [169 U.S. 649, 656] explanations of it, was clearly. though quaintly, stated in the leading case known as 'Calvin's Case,' or the 'Case of the Postnati,' decided in 1608, after a hearing in the exchequer chamber before the lord chancellor and all the judges of England, and reported by Lord Coke and by Lord Ellesmere. Calvin's Case, 7 Coke, 1, 4b-6a, 18a, 18b; Ellesmere, Postnati, 62-64; s. c. 2 How. St. Tr. 559, 607, 613-617, 639, 640, 659, 679.

The English authorities ever since are to the like effect. Co. Litt. 8a, 128b; Lord Hale, in Harg. Law Tracts, 210, and in 1 Hale, P. C. 61, 62; 1 Bl. Comm. 366, 369, 370, 374; 4 Bl. Comm. 74, 92; Lord Kenyon, in Doe v. Jones, 4 Term R. 300, 308; Cockb. Nat. 7; Dicey, Confl. Laws, pp. 173-177, 741.

In Udny v. Udny (1869) L. R. 1 H. L. Sc. 441

U.S. v. WONG KIM ARK, 169 U.S. 649 (1898)

Cockb. Nat. 7.

Digest of the Law of England with Reference to the Conflict of Laws, published in 1896 Dicey, Confl. Laws, pp. 173-177, 741.

In Inglis v. Sailors' Snug Harbor (1830) 3 Pet. 99

The English statute of 11 & 12 Wm. III. (1700) c. 6

In McCreery v. Somerville (1824) 9 Wheat. 354,

Levy v. McCartee (1832) 6 Pet. 102, 112, 113, 115,

In Dred Scott v. Sandford (1857) 19 How. 393

In U. S. v. Rhodes (1866), Abb. (U. S.) 28, 40, 41, Fed. Cas. No. 16,151.

Gardner v. Ward (1805) 2 Mass. 244,

." State v. Manuel (1838) 4 Dev. & b. 20, 24-26.

Lynch v. Clarke (1844) 1 Sandf. Ch. 583.

The same doctrine was repeatedly affirmed in the executive departments, as, for instance, by Mr. Marcy, secretary of state, in 1854 ( 2 Whart. Int. Dig. [2d Ed.] p. 394); by Attorney General Black in 1859 (9 Ops. Attys. Gen. 373); and by Attorney General Bates in 1862 (10 Ops. Attys. Gen. 328, 382, 394, 396).

Mandoli v. Acheson, 344 U.S. 133 (1952)

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

Thanks, Creeksneakers. I'm not a lawyer, but I'm fairly well versed in tbe legal schmegalities around this birfer case. But your post summed up a good chunk of it.

Basically, the principle I references is known as jus soli, or born on our soil. It derives from British common law and, according to NUMEROUS lawyers and just about every member of congress, it is the law of the land.

I challenged it several months ago. I believed that two parent NBC was a more reasonable explanation and more rooted in the Founding Fathers intent. It was pointed out to me that the Constitution is a framework, not a point by point law menu.

Without getting into a long legal treatise, they convinced me that jus soli is the law of the land, despite my reservations about it.

I can't explain it as good as they did and I won't try. But I suggest that these birfoons foist their definition of NBC up against a real lawyer. Let them get the tongue lashing I received.

kandis1105 9 months ago

creeksneakers,

Thank you for the links. I will judge for myself

blackmonrikker,

What kind of smoke screen are you looking for, for his removal?
- an NBC one. (historical quotes, documents)
- something about his forged BC (proven)
- his BC in a lawsuit in Sept (coming soon)
- treason, fraud, lies

C Session 9 months ago

You people that are getting mad at blackmonrikker had better read what he is saying. I believe he would like to see something that would prove, beyond a reasonable doubt; something that would hold up in court; something that, like he says would dis-allow Obama from running again.

I agree it is fruitless to try to get him thrown out in this term. If for no other reason, time is on his side. Personally, I don't believe he is a citizen at all, natural born or whatever. If he is not a legally natural born citizen, then he must not be a citizen at all, since he was never naturalized through immigration proceedings. But that is just my gut feeling. I have no proof, and like blackmonrikker has asked, just get the smoking gun. He makes some pretty good legal arguments.

I agree it is suspicious that Obama has not released his original BC, school records or his 1980 passport imformation, and it is enough to make me think he has something to hide. But really people, let's get some real proof!

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

C Session, that's the most intelligent birfer comment I've ever read. Most birfers scream and rant a bunch of "ifs, maybes, and 'I believe...' and 'common sense would tell you...'

Not one of these things will hold up in court. You'll never get a groundswell of support based on such flimsy evidence. The fact that you don't seem to realize that is what makes most rational people laugh at you. Have you never been in a court of law?

Now, I believe President Obama is what he says he is--a U.S. citizen. But if evidence is produced that says he is not, I say boot him out on his ass. The Constitution has specific requirements for the presidency. I think most Americans would agree with me on that one.

kandis1105: "What kind of smoke screen are you looking for, for his removal?
- an NBC one. (historical quotes, documents)
- something about his forged BC (proven)
- his BC in a lawsuit in Sept (coming soon)
- treason, fraud, lies"

See? This is more unsubstantiated birfer claptrap. Who proved his BC was forged? Name the person and show his credentials. Your other comments aren't worthy of comment.

jimmy.simpson55 9 months ago

I get it now, you are a nigga with an "education". Did they let you take your finals in ebonics?

C Session 9 months ago

Jimmy:
What's with the name calling? I didn't notice the color of anybody's skin on these postings, and if you are refering to the author of this thread, his (or her) postings have been nothing but inteligent and thought provoking. You sound like the liberals who, when not finding something you agree with, start calling names.

And I am one he would refer to as a birfer. I have stated in previous posting that I don't believe Obama is a citizen, let alone a natural born citizen, but that is my opinion. I have nothing to back it up. That's all our moderator is asking for.

blackmonrikker 9 months ago

Jimmy.simpson55: "I get it now, you are a nigga with an "education". "

Nope. I dropped out of college in my senior year to raise my family. But I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

jimmy.simpson55 9 months ago

A real man can finish school and raise a family, it is called hard work and dedication. Look into it, but I guess it is easier to have an excuse for whitey holding you down. FYI, while you are blaming whitey, the Mexicans are your real enemy. They have already taken over your minority spot, and they are quickly beginning to eliminate your race. Also, unlike you, I don't mind using my real name, nor am I ashamed of what I say. Look me up sometime.

Jimmy "Jim" Simpson
Portland OR

C Session 9 months ago

Jimmy, you're getting a little off topic here. I must have missed blackmonrikker blaming whitey for anything anyway.

Remember we're looking for the smoking gun that will end Obama's reign as the new king of America.

All the man asked is where is it?

thomas_w_bowman 9 months ago

Two Questions remain:
1) Hospital
2) Delivery Doctor, Date & Time

Simple enough ?

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